Yellowdog Granny reminds us that while many modern christian fundamentalists claim America was founded as a christian nation, the Founding Fathers had a different view. They believed they had founded a secular government that would grant freedom to all citizens to believe (or not believe) in any religion they wanted.
I finally got around to bookmarking her site. Some great stuff comes out of there.
ReplyDeletetnlib,
ReplyDeleteWhile you're at it, you might want to bookmark this, from the Wikipedia article on the Treaty of Tripoli.
As a linguist, I can definitely relate to the expression "lost in translation."
By the way, it was President John Adams (not President Washington) who signed the treaty.
Whatever problems the translation might have, this is the translation presented to the Senate and the one they approved. Why would they approve language they did not believe to be true?
ReplyDeleteAlso from Wikipedia:
ReplyDelete"The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution explicitly forbids the federal government from enacting any law respecting a religious establishment, and thus forbids either designating an official church for the United States, or interfering with State and local official churches — which were common when the First Amendment was enacted. It did not prevent state governments from establishing official churches. Connecticut continued to do so until it replaced its colonial Charter with the Connecticut Constitution of 1818; Massachusetts retained an establishment of religion in general until 1833. (The Massachusetts system required every man to belong to some church, and pay taxes towards it; while it was formally neutral between denominations, in practice the indifferent would be counted as belonging to the majority denomination, and in some cases religious minorities had trouble being recognized at all.)" [Emphasis added]
Here's the source
So as you can see, the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment was originally more a question of federalism than an outright ban on government endorsing religion. Individual states were free to address the issue, and states like Connecticut and Massachusetts in fact did, well into the nineteenth century.
Before you ask, let me say that I don't agree with either the Connecticut or the Massachusetts models. Having lived for a year as a Baptist in Poland, which is overwhelmingly Catholic, I see where even a quasi-state religion can adversely affect the rights of minority religions. And having lived for nine years in Germany, where the government is involved in the levying of church taxes on Lutherans and Catholics, I don't think that's a good idea either.
But I feel we've gone too far in the opposite direction in this country. To eliminate all expression of religious faith from the public square for fear of somehow establishing a Church of America stands the First Amendment on its head. The Free Expression Clause and the Establishment Clause shouldn't be viewed as a zero sum game.
In a truly free and tolerant society, widely differing religious beliefs (or the lack thereof) should be able to peacefully coexist in public discourse without someone feeling offended.
In a similar vein (also from Wikipedia):
ReplyDelete"The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution explicitly forbids the federal government from enacting any law respecting a religious establishment, and thus forbids either designating an official church for the United States, or interfering with State and local official churches — which were common when the First Amendment was enacted. It did not prevent state governments from establishing official churches. Connecticut continued to do so until it replaced its colonial Charter with the Connecticut Constitution of 1818; Massachusetts retained an establishment of religion in general until 1833. (The Massachusetts system required every man to belong to some church, and pay taxes towards it; while it was formally neutral between denominations, in practice the indifferent would be counted as belonging to the majority denomination, and in some cases religious minorities had trouble being recognized at all.)" [Emphasis added]
Here's the source
So as you can see, the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment was originally more a question of federalism than an outright ban on government endorsing religion. Individual states were free to address the issue, and states like Connecticut and Massachusetts in fact did, well into the nineteenth century.
Before you ask, let me say that I don't agree with either the Connecticut or the Massachusetts models. Having lived for a year as a Baptist in Poland, which is overwhelmingly Catholic, I see where even a quasi-state religion can adversely affect the rights of minority religions. And having lived for nine years in Germany, where the government is involved in the levying of church taxes on Lutherans and Catholics, I don't think that's a good idea either.
But I feel we've gone too far in the opposite direction in this country. To eliminate all expression of religious faith from the public square for fear of somehow establishing a Church of America stands the First Amendment on its head. The Free Expression Clause and the Establishment Clause shouldn't be viewed as a zero sum game.
In a truly free and tolerant society, widely differing religious beliefs (or the lack thereof) should be able to peacefully coexist in public discourse without someone feeling offended.
Sorry about what amounts to a double post. After drafting the next to last comment, I noticed that Ted had posted another comment. Thinking my comment hadn't gone through, I made a few minor changes and posted it again.
ReplyDeleteMy bad!
It was John Adams, not George Washington, who wrote that (get the picture right), and if you read the whole article, it is basically saying that the US won't force its Christian beliefs on a non-Christian country.
ReplyDeleteThanks, anonymous, for pointing out which President actually signed the Treaty of Tripoli. (I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but it doesn't hurt to drive home the point).
ReplyDeleteAnd while we're on the subject of John Adams, let me share my favorite quote from our second President:
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”
Here's the source.