"For Conservatives These Include Bricks, Bullets, Intimidation, Vandalism and Occasionally Murder."
Examples?
On the other hand, here's a link to a recent poll showing that 41% of Tea Party members are Democrats and Independents.
Another poll shows that more Americans support the Tea Party movement than oppose it (28% v. 26%). Here's a link to that poll.
So why all the the demonizing? That's easy: to sway the 46% that are "either ambivalent or have no idea what's going on."
If the Democrats can't convince those people that conservatives in general and the Tea Partiers in particular are evil incarnate, there's going to be a price to pay come November.
Good luck. It's a hard sell - at least outside your own echo chamber.
So let me get this straight. I'm supposed to prove to you that Right-Wing whack jobs use bricks, bullets, intimidation, vandalism, and occasionally murder to get their point across.
How about reading the paper numbnuts. I created this poster the same week members of congress had bricks thrown through their windows, were spat on, and called niggers.
For the murder part we only have to go as far back as the last time an abortion doctor was murdered. Or are you going to pretend that that was some liberal.
When you right wingers can't win the argument by either using a valid argument or stealing the election you get violent and act more stupidly than normal.
Come on CT, that is something that hasn't even happened yet (and probably won't). Lefty and I are talking about incidents that have happened, and they were done by teabaggers.
"Come on CT, that is something that hasn't even happened yet (and probably won't). Lefty and I are talking about incidents that have happened, and they were done by teabaggers."
Have there been dispicable acts by extremists on the Right? Absolutely! Do those acts occur in sufficient numbers to smear conservatives in general? If that were the case, why would there be a need to plant astroturf "teabaggers" in the crowd this Thursday?
"When you right wingers can't win the argument by either using a valid argument..."
OK, let's argue then. Convince me that 1) trillion-dollar deficits well into the next decade; 2) a tax code that allows nearly half of those who file to get off with either paying nothing or actually receiving a windfall, while the "producers" are penalized; and 3) whispers of a European-styled Value Added Tax in addition to the income tax will result in anything but bankrupting this country, much in the same way as Greece has been.
I know, I know -- Bush added greatly to the deficit, too. And that will be forever to his shame. But the situation has reached critical mass. Something must be done to curb this out-of-control spending. If not now, when?
CT- You have read this blog long enough to know that I wasn't "smearing" conservatives in general. I actually respect traditional, thinking, old-line conservatives (even though I seldom agree with them). It's the racist teabagging nutzoids that see everyone that doesn't agree with them as an enemy, that scares me. I fully believe that many of them, if they haven't already resorted to violence, are just a step away from it.
Ted- One need only google "wto demonstrations" to realize that there's violence on the Left too. And racism against government officials also includes anti-semitism - just ask Eric Cantor. Violence and racism on either side of the political divide is wrong and should be condemned.
As far as the "racist teabagging nutzoids" are concerned - I think their numbers and influence within the Tea Party movement are wildly exaggerated: by the media, because it sells newspapers; and by the Left, because it marginalizes legitimate concerns about out-of-control government spending ("What are you, a teabagger?") That's why people like Jason Levin (CrashtheTeaParty.org) and Craig Varoga (TheTeaPartyisOver.org) have done everything they can to paint the Tea Party movement with the broadest brush possible.
But as far as "traditional, thinking, old-line conservatives" are concerned, I wish you could meet Jodi Maner.
Jodi is a naturalized U.S. citizen (born in Canada) and a registered nurse turned legal nurse consultant (that's where our paths first crossed). She left her native country at least in part because of her frustrations with the single-payer healthcare system there. Like you and me, she now calls Amarillo home.
Jodi is intelligent, thoughtful, articulate - and very active in the Tea Party movement. Don't expect her to "get violent and act more stupidly than normal" - as Lefty's sweeping generalization seems to imply.
Speaking of Lefty, if you're still out there, do you care to debate any of the issues I raised earlier (see numbers 1) through 3), above)?
It's so sweet that you miss me. However, I've got a job and having a discussion with you is really pretty near the bottom of my priority list.
However, since you seem to want some input from me, here you go.
You have given me a single example of one person who isn't a conservative nutbag (so you say). Well there's a little show on Faux News called the Glenn Beck show...maybe you've heard of it.
That sonofabitch whom the Teabaggers have embraced spews enough hatred and vitriol to make up for 1,000 of your Jodi whatserfaces. He's the guy who says Obama is a racist, that he hates white people. The guy who says that he fears that the left is going to get violent. The fact that your side embraces somebody like this gives you zero credibility.
And if you want to question me about his quotes learn to use a search engine and youtube. I'm already wasting my time writing this. I don't need to teach you remedial search engine usage.
Oh, I almost missed it.
Issue 1) The trillion dollar deficit
Your boy Bush is the guy who went from a SURPLUS to quadrupling the debt in only eight short years. The Republicans seem to be experts in spending money and having nothing to show for it. Obama is faced with unfucking the economy that the Republicans rode right into the ground. While I'm not a fan of deficit spending, I think that the short term goal of getting the economy back on track is infinitely more important than the short term goal of cutting the deficit. And here's a little long term thinking for you...getting the economy back on track will help to create the revenue that will eventually cut the deficit.
2) If you make less than 50k a year you shouldn't pay a goddamn dime in Federal income taxes. However, something seems fundamentally wrong with getting a refund that is more than you actually paid. That doesn't mean that I'm willing to scrap the tax code for somethign stupid like the Fair Tax or some other such scheme that is designed to screw the middle class for the benefit of the rich (yet again).
3) Are you seriously asking me to debate the merits of "whispers of a European-styled Value Added Tax"? Is this some other news flash that Beck or Limbaugh pulled out of their anal craniums per usual? I don't like the idea of a VAT. In fact, a VAT is akin to the Fair Tax scheme that politicians like Huckabee keep touting.
So it almost sounds as if we agree on 1 1/2 points of of your 3 mentioned above.
Now, if I don't answer right away to whatever you end up spewing in response to this don't get all upset. I've got shit to do. Besides, I still have some hatemail to answer back on my own website that I haven't gotten around to for a couple of weeks.
Lefty, I've got a day job too, which is why I'm typing this after 10 PM. I really need my beauty rest (one look at my face and you'd agree), but I can ill afford to spend as much time blogging during the day as I have lately. So I'll make this fairly short.
I'm glad we agree on at least some things. Over the last couple of years, Ted and I have found some common ground too, and I think he enjoys that as much as I do. Some things are Right or Left, but other things are just simply Right or Wrong.
I don't know how old you are, but in my 60 years on this planet I've learned that the Left-Right divide is rarely as bad as some would have you believe. During the Vietnam War, I survived two student strikes in the spring semester of my sophomore year alone, and as a soldier in Germany in the '80's, I saw hundreds of thousands take to the streets to protest the deployment of Cruise and Pershing missiles. But somehow, through it all, I graduated from college, and the Cold War was won. We'll make it through this divide too.
But the key is contained in the title of this post: "Civil Discourse". Starting with attacks on President Clinton, and continuing through the Bush years and now into the Obama Administration, I've seen it get worse and worse, mainly because each side thinks that a lack of civility by the other side gives them license to respond in kind.
Don't get me wrong; there are dangerous people on both sides of the political divide, but they're the exception, not the rule. And getting your dander up over them does nothing but raise your blood pressure. Civil discourse, on the other hand, might - just might - moderate their stance by demonstrating that political opponents are people too, not the caricature they concocted in their own minds. I've seen cases of lifelong racists having a complete change of heart simply because they finally met someone from the other race who related to them as another human being.
I've gotta quit - it's almost 11 o'clock. Believe it or not, but this is "fairly short" - for me!
I doubt if you'll become a Republican (let alone join the Tea Party movement) as a result of my soliloquy, but maybe the next time you hear the word "conservative," you'll think of someone who took the time (when he could least afford it) to reveal his own humanity to you - even though you started out by calling him "numbnuts" :)
ANONYMOUS COMMENTS WILL NOT BE PUBLISHED. And neither will racist,homophobic, or misogynistic comments. I do not mind if you disagree, but make your case in a decent manner.
From the blog LeftWingConspiracy.com.
"For Conservatives These Include Bricks, Bullets, Intimidation, Vandalism and Occasionally Murder."
ReplyDeleteExamples?
On the other hand, here's a link to a recent poll showing that 41% of Tea Party members are Democrats and Independents.
Another poll shows that more Americans support the Tea Party movement than oppose it (28% v. 26%). Here's a link to that poll.
So why all the the demonizing? That's easy: to sway the 46% that are "either ambivalent or have no idea what's going on."
If the Democrats can't convince those people that conservatives in general and the Tea Partiers in particular are evil incarnate, there's going to be a price to pay come November.
Good luck. It's a hard sell - at least outside your own echo chamber.
So let me get this straight. I'm supposed to prove to you that Right-Wing whack jobs use bricks, bullets, intimidation, vandalism, and occasionally murder to get their point across.
ReplyDeleteHow about reading the paper numbnuts. I created this poster the same week members of congress had bricks thrown through their windows, were spat on, and called niggers.
For the murder part we only have to go as far back as the last time an abortion doctor was murdered. Or are you going to pretend that that was some liberal.
When you right wingers can't win the argument by either using a valid argument or stealing the election you get violent and act more stupidly than normal.
~Lefty
"How about reading the paper numbnuts."
ReplyDeleteLike this AP article?
Agents provacateurs - how clever!
Come on CT, that is something that hasn't even happened yet (and probably won't). Lefty and I are talking about incidents that have happened, and they were done by teabaggers.
ReplyDelete"Come on CT, that is something that hasn't even happened yet (and probably won't). Lefty and I are talking about incidents that have happened, and they were done by teabaggers."
ReplyDeleteHave there been dispicable acts by extremists on the Right? Absolutely! Do those acts occur in sufficient numbers to smear conservatives in general? If that were the case, why would there be a need to plant astroturf "teabaggers" in the crowd this Thursday?
"When you right wingers can't win the argument by either using a valid argument..."
OK, let's argue then. Convince me that 1) trillion-dollar deficits well into the next decade; 2) a tax code that allows nearly half of those who file to get off with either paying nothing or actually receiving a windfall, while the "producers" are penalized; and 3) whispers of a European-styled Value Added Tax in addition to the income tax will result in anything but bankrupting this country, much in the same way as Greece has been.
I know, I know -- Bush added greatly to the deficit, too. And that will be forever to his shame. But the situation has reached critical mass. Something must be done to curb this out-of-control spending. If not now, when?
CT-
ReplyDeleteYou have read this blog long enough to know that I wasn't "smearing" conservatives in general. I actually respect traditional, thinking, old-line conservatives (even though I seldom agree with them). It's the racist teabagging nutzoids that see everyone that doesn't agree with them as an enemy, that scares me. I fully believe that many of them, if they haven't already resorted to violence, are just a step away from it.
Ted-
ReplyDeleteOne need only google "wto demonstrations" to realize that there's violence on the Left too. And racism against government officials also includes anti-semitism - just ask Eric Cantor. Violence and racism on either side of the political divide is wrong and should be condemned.
As far as the "racist teabagging nutzoids" are concerned - I think their numbers and influence within the Tea Party movement are wildly exaggerated: by the media, because it sells newspapers; and by the Left, because it marginalizes legitimate concerns about out-of-control government spending ("What are you, a teabagger?") That's why people like Jason Levin (CrashtheTeaParty.org) and Craig Varoga (TheTeaPartyisOver.org) have done everything they can to paint the Tea Party movement with the broadest brush possible.
But as far as "traditional, thinking, old-line conservatives" are concerned, I wish you could meet Jodi Maner.
Jodi is a naturalized U.S. citizen (born in Canada) and a registered nurse turned legal nurse consultant (that's where our paths first crossed). She left her native country at least in part because of her frustrations with the single-payer healthcare system there. Like you and me, she now calls Amarillo home.
Jodi is intelligent, thoughtful, articulate - and very active in the Tea Party movement. Don't expect her to "get violent and act more stupidly than normal" - as Lefty's sweeping generalization seems to imply.
Speaking of Lefty, if you're still out there, do you care to debate any of the issues I raised earlier (see numbers 1) through 3), above)?
Curious,
ReplyDeleteIt's so sweet that you miss me. However, I've got a job and having a discussion with you is really pretty near the bottom of my priority list.
However, since you seem to want some input from me, here you go.
You have given me a single example of one person who isn't a conservative nutbag (so you say). Well there's a little show on Faux News called the Glenn Beck show...maybe you've heard of it.
That sonofabitch whom the Teabaggers have embraced spews enough hatred and vitriol to make up for 1,000 of your Jodi whatserfaces. He's the guy who says Obama is a racist, that he hates white people. The guy who says that he fears that the left is going to get violent. The fact that your side embraces somebody like this gives you zero credibility.
And if you want to question me about his quotes learn to use a search engine and youtube. I'm already wasting my time writing this. I don't need to teach you remedial search engine usage.
Oh, I almost missed it.
Issue 1) The trillion dollar deficit
Your boy Bush is the guy who went from a SURPLUS to quadrupling the debt in only eight short years. The Republicans seem to be experts in spending money and having nothing to show for it. Obama is faced with unfucking the economy that the Republicans rode right into the ground. While I'm not a fan of deficit spending, I think that the short term goal of getting the economy back on track is infinitely more important than the short term goal of cutting the deficit. And here's a little long term thinking for you...getting the economy back on track will help to create the revenue that will eventually cut the deficit.
2) If you make less than 50k a year you shouldn't pay a goddamn dime in Federal income taxes. However, something seems fundamentally wrong with getting a refund that is more than you actually paid. That doesn't mean that I'm willing to scrap the tax code for somethign stupid like the Fair Tax or some other such scheme that is designed to screw the middle class for the benefit of the rich (yet again).
3) Are you seriously asking me to debate the merits of "whispers of a European-styled Value Added Tax"? Is this some other news flash that Beck or Limbaugh pulled out of their anal craniums per usual? I don't like the idea of a VAT. In fact, a VAT is akin to the Fair Tax scheme that politicians like Huckabee keep touting.
So it almost sounds as if we agree on 1 1/2 points of of your 3 mentioned above.
Now, if I don't answer right away to whatever you end up spewing in response to this don't get all upset. I've got shit to do. Besides, I still have some hatemail to answer back on my own website that I haven't gotten around to for a couple of weeks.
Lefty,
ReplyDeleteI've got a day job too, which is why I'm typing this after 10 PM. I really need my beauty rest (one look at my face and you'd agree), but I can ill afford to spend as much time blogging during the day as I have lately. So I'll make this fairly short.
I'm glad we agree on at least some things. Over the last couple of years, Ted and I have found some common ground too, and I think he enjoys that as much as I do. Some things are Right or Left, but other things are just simply Right or Wrong.
I don't know how old you are, but in my 60 years on this planet I've learned that the Left-Right divide is rarely as bad as some would have you believe. During the Vietnam War, I survived two student strikes in the spring semester of my sophomore year alone, and as a soldier in Germany in the '80's, I saw hundreds of thousands take to the streets to protest the deployment of Cruise and Pershing missiles. But somehow, through it all, I graduated from college, and the Cold War was won. We'll make it through this divide too.
But the key is contained in the title of this post: "Civil Discourse". Starting with attacks on President Clinton, and continuing through the Bush years and now into the Obama Administration, I've seen it get worse and worse, mainly because each side thinks that a lack of civility by the other side gives them license to respond in kind.
Don't get me wrong; there are dangerous people on both sides of the political divide, but they're the exception, not the rule. And getting your dander up over them does nothing but raise your blood pressure. Civil discourse, on the other hand, might - just might - moderate their stance by demonstrating that political opponents are people too, not the caricature they concocted in their own minds. I've seen cases of lifelong racists having a complete change of heart simply because they finally met someone from the other race who related to them as another human being.
I've gotta quit - it's almost 11 o'clock. Believe it or not, but this is "fairly short" - for me!
I doubt if you'll become a Republican (let alone join the Tea Party movement) as a result of my soliloquy, but maybe the next time you hear the word "conservative," you'll think of someone who took the time (when he could least afford it) to reveal his own humanity to you - even though you started out by calling him "numbnuts" :)
G'night Lefty!
"Come on CT, that is something that hasn't even happened yet (and probably won't)."
ReplyDeleteDon't be so sure.
Have you seen this article? (Be patient; it may take a while to load.)
A noteworthy quote about Kathy Sullivan, the former New Hampshire Democratic State Party Chairman:
“'This is Kathy’s [Sullivan] project,' the source told NowHampshire.com. 'She is absolutely obsessed with painting the tea party people as racists.'"
And another one about the national effort:
"Similar 'crash the tea party' efforts are taking place throughout the country on Tax Day."
If there's a significant increase in the number of racist signs at these events tomorrow, we'll all know where they came from.